I think you're missing the point. The reason some of us aren't writing Clemns off yet is because we HAVEN'T seen what he can or can not do yet. 2007 was not a fair shake and I don't buy 'if he's so great, why trade for Favre' talk. Woody had a woody for Favre, end of story on that. I'd also disagree with one of your other premises. "If he feels the Jets truly have a great QB on their current roster the Jets will sit tight." I don't thin Ryan is looking for a "great" QB. I think he'll settle for a care taker this year.
What did you see from Chad Pennington when he was starting in 2007 to make you think he could ever be a starting QB in this league again? He looked worse than Clemens.
what is with you people? Clemens did pretty good for having one of the worst offensive lines in the league in '07. Let him and ratliff fight it out but all this anti-clemens shit is absolutely wrong. Give this guy a real chance, stop this hysteria.
I don't know how one quarter of play sets you up for a career when the rest of your play isn't very good at all. I was rooting as hard as any Jet fan for Clemens to be successful, but in three years he's shown nothing. I don't see how anyone can expect more at this point.
He did pretty good? He was terrible. He had the worst QB rating in the league. Despite the losses Pennington's stats were much better. In fact it wasn't even close.
I can't see how anyone can be terribly confident in Ratliff or Clemens. The only thing that I am confident in is that our quarterback will be handing off the football many many times this season.
Pennington completed 68.8% of his passes, threw for 10 TDs against 9 interceptions, and had a QB rating of 86.1. Clemens completed 52%, threw 5 touchdowns versus 10 intrerceptions for a QB rating of 60.9. How in the world can you say Pennington was remotely as bad as Clemens. Chad's problem that year was that he tried to do too much with everyone calling for his head and it backfired. You had to know that within his physical limitations Pennington was going to be successful again.
The difference between Clemens and Ratliff is that we've seen Clemens and he's shown nothing. People bring out all sort of reasons for this, but no one argues the fact that he hasn't been successful to this point. Ratliff has the size, the arm, and he looked great when he did play, so hope springs eternal. I don't think anyone can say with any degree of certainty that Ratliff is the answer, but he has looked good, unlike Clemens.
I would be open to Boller or Troy Smith coming to Jets but for one simple reason... if they come in it's because Ryan has seen something in them while coaching in Baltimore... apart from those 2 i'm ok with sticking with what we have... hopefully we'll find out it isn't that bad . Ps can you imagine Ainge starting our first season game? Hahahah that would be a good laugh after all these Ratliff vs Clemens threads
If it's Ainge I'd be thrilled. He's got the size and arm. On another note it's starting to look like the Jets might have a very real shot at Sanchez or possibly even Stafford. It appears as though the 49ers and making a serious push for Warner. If Warner is serious and the 49ers get him (he took a physical today), there would be a very good chance Sanchez, or even Stafford (if the Lions pass on a QB) are there for the Jets. Now that would be an interesting situation. :wink:
Okay, just so I'm clear on this. You believe Clemens can be a good starting quarterback because of a few throws he made in one quarter of one football game?
All I'm saying is I think he's shown potential and I think it's too early to give up on him. It's OK to disagree.
Enough with the stats already. Did you actually watch the games? Pennington looked horrendous. Clemens looked pretty damn good to me when he shredded the Ravens' D for a 4th quarter comeback. By your logic then Carson Palmer must suck too since he posted a 69 QB rating last season and threw more interceptions than touchdowns. What about Marc Bulger? Two years ago Bulger was an elite quarterback, now he looks like a CFL scrub. Trent Green has been a good QB his whole career; last year he threw 0 TD and 6 INT for a rating of 41.7. Why? Because they play on shitty teams. Just like Clemens played on a shitty team in '07. There's no way to know what he can do until we give him a fair chance. Pennington is the king of statistical illusions because he plays dink and dunk and everyone knows that.
Bulger, Green, and Palmer have also shown they can play. Clemens has never shown he can play. And yes I watched the games and I saw Pennington forcing plays to make something happen causing him to throw more interceptions than usual. Clemens simply looked bad. Outside of one quarter of play, no one has given me a single reason why they think Clemens can be great. Is it his great arm? His pocket presense? His ability to read defenses? His accuracy on long throws? I've seen none of this. And I've seen almost all the games.
People have given plenty of reasons why he still has potential and you're choosing to ignore them. None of our other QBs have shown they can play ball in the NFL and neither have any of next year's rookies, so how could you start any of them if none of them have shown "they can be great"?
Are you kidding me? No one in this thread is saying that Clemens can be great. But since your argument is pretty flimsy, you are trying to make it about 'greatness' and not ability to win. And I know for a fact that Pennington never has and never will be great, but you defend him and probably will to his dying day. Neither of them looked very good in 2007, but to say the guy showed nothing is just stupid. He's got a great release, strong arm, and started off looking poised before he realized he was stuck behind the 8-ball after Chad 'tried too hard' or whatever nonsense that was. You dismiss other peoples' 'excuses' and then make your own for the guy you want to defend. Sorry, but what I saw from Chad was a multi-year starting veteran looking like deer in headlights, and you bash Clemens for the exact same thing. Don't give me that 'trying too hard to make things happen' nonsense. Chad cracked like the sophomore player that Clemens was. I'm not sure what Clemens can be, but your arguments against him just suck.
I was willing to give clemens a chance, but when he was put in for Favre in week 2 against SD - he led a nice drive down to the red zone, and then shit his pants and threw an embarrassing pick to DRC... there was no WR in the area, just 3 SD DBs... he had time and a pocket to work from too. I don't know how he had a step back in his 3rd year in this league in preseason as well. He did not impress me at all, and I was looking for positives.... I don't think this kid has what it takes in the NFL.... Ratliff is a bigger question mark because he hasn't faced 1st stringers yet, so you can't even put a grade on him, but he has to be tested to see if he is legit..and Ainge needs to just get on the field. We are dealing with potential, not proven starters... A blue chip QB prospect from this draft would be at the same position as the QBs on the roster now if he was drafted. They'd all be at the same starting position with this new CS, even with Schotty here. The consensus needs to realize that the Jets have one of the worst QB situations in the NFL and it can't be treated lightly. This isn't a running back or Linebacker or DE. QBs aren't plug and play. As of right now, the Jets are in worse shape than the 49ers, but better than the Lions.
